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zeldathemes
Dottier Than Thou

Mentally 12/physically 29, Swedish, autistic, emetophobic, sarcastic, cynical, aggressively feministic and extremely passionate about fiction/media and criticism thereof. Happily devoid of sanity and neurotic as fuck.

Multi-fandom blog. Currently a lot of:
Brooklyn Nine Nine. Orphan Black. The Walking Dead. Sleepy Hollow. Shameless US. Arrow. Faking It. Once Upon a Time. Agents of Shield.
Hey, I saw your post about what people want for Katrina in Sleepy Hollow. As a Katrina fan, I want to say, it got me thinking. I've said one or two of the things in the first list, but I also like your things about how we should know more about her. My personal reason for Katrina-love is I was named after the book character, which means I'm very drawn to her--almost irrationally so, admittedly, at times. I hope with her out of purgatory maybe, hopefully we'll get to see her do more stuff. :)

Anonymous

acceber74:

sleepynegress:

I get wanting to love a character because they have the same name as you.

What I still don’t get is how that somehow made you blind to the problematic writing, thus far. I find that the opposite happens, when I have a favorite character.

When I love a character I am extra-protective of the way they are handled and I don’t see that from you guys.

I see delusional projection of an ideal that hasn’t actually been shown on the show.

I see people talking about a “badass witch” when the reality is that the most dynamic visual witch powers we’ve seen have come from Serilda.

Why is it always the generic “more stuff” being called for, and no callouts at the writers for making Katrina, -this favorite character of yours, into a regressive trope?

Why is there nothing out there from you guys criticizing the fact that she has been written inconsistently (debutante or Quaker)?? Why is there nothing about the fact that we haven’t seen who she is outside of others’ perspectives, except for five minutes in the finale??

Why did it take my post for you to start thinking about these things?

image

I feel like most of you love the idea of her, but allow the realities of the problems presented in her character to slide, for some reason.

I mean after this??:

image

-I would expect her fans to be pissed right the fuck off and write all kinds of interesting meta talking about why this kind of shit is wrong or writing alts where Katrina actually was the badass witch in this situation.

…But there was nothing, no acknowledgment whatsoever that Katrina was basically this:

image

Their meta usually consists of “Ichabod’s married”, “you support adultery if you want Ichabbie to happen”, and “the show isn’t about romance [in reference to Ichabbie specifically]”, etc…

Okay this one I will comment on because I feel like you hit your head on it with “I feel most of you love the idea of her” - she really was a character with a lot of potential, no matter what your preferences. She could have been what she seems to have been originally intended as: a compelling well-written character that you enjoy as Ichabod’s wife and as being part of the plot and who contributes to the fight by being a badass witch. She could have been a compelling sympathetic character that you’re sad to see go when she heroically sacrifices herself for the greater good at some point in the future. She could have been a great villain/force of evil. She even could have been a great social commentary - the female counterpart to Ichabod in discovering the modern world, a look on the changes since the 1800s from the eyes of someone who now suddenly has rights and options that women back then could only dream of.

She had so much potential, in so many ways, she could have been any or all of those things - but she wasn’t and she isn’t. As long as it took me to accept that (I held onto hope that she could be fixed as an afterthought, at the very least, but I’ve even given up on that now), I never deluded myself into thinking she wasn’t better in my head than she was on screen - but maybe some fans would rather ignore reality. But if s2 plays out the way it looks like it will they’re going to need some stronger denial. 

plays

acceber74:

moraven12:

briony-in-the-nettles:

moraven12:

briony-in-the-nettles:

moraven12:

briony-in-the-nettles:

moraven12:

OK I am really feeling for Katia in this segment. Do fans really believe Katrina was showing some sort of dark side by ‘making’ Abbie remain in purgatory. Do these fans forget that Katrina DID state the rules of her leaving and another staying, did they also forget that Abbie choose to remain, mainly so she could confront her own fears of Molock. Abbie who is no push over and had been making her own decisions since episode 1.

Are these fans and the, suppose to be neutral, interviewer forgetting that apart from the non-excitant romance there is a battle of good/evil going on. Its like saying ‘when will Frodo get it on with Sam, and forget about the ring of doom they’re meant to be taking to the mountain’

I am sorry for Katia if this is all she gets asked….’Is she keeping the golden couple apart’….Well done to Katia for laughing it off and remaining professional.

Well I for one am looking forward to seeing what makes Katrina….Quaker, Wife, Mother and above all a free spirited Witch in a time when the mere accusation of witchcraft would have the innocent burnt!  

Seriously, it seems pretty obvious to me that this interviewer was giving Katia the opportunity to smack down Katrina’s critics. She was joking but in Katrina’s favor, the question was meant to be over the top because the interviewer found it that unbelievable herself. And frankly, her question and her follow up saying some people ship Katrina with Abbie just reeks of that certain segment of fandom that comes to Katrina’s defense because of feminism!, but never bothers to think critically about how the writing of Katrina is about as stereotypically anti-feminist as it gets.

And I’m sorry but its a valid criticism to look at Katrina’s reveal of the rules involved with her leaving purgatory and question why they were just then coming up. I don’t really believe that Katrina is evil (disclaimer: I do believe it would make her character far more interesting). All the evidence points to Katrina continuing to be a tragic victim of circumstances over and over again… I might regret that later, but really, I don’t see anything to prove otherwise right now.

But come on, the the writing could have been tighter. They clearly overplayed their hand with her mysteriousness. And they used her as a plot device far too many times. People don’t want to look at character and see ‘oh that had to happen for Abbie to stay in purgatory so they made Katrina unusually tight lipped about’. They see scenes like the one in John Doe where she clearly wasn’t pressed for time and they want to see her motivations not her role as a plot device. She didn’t have a single scene from her own POV last season. Shipping aside, is it really all that surprising that kind of speculation is happening?

I agree on the writers making Katrina a plot device. But I am one of those minority of fan that were happy to sit back and wait for Katrina to shine in S2, since S1 was all about establishing who and what the witnesses were, what their past lives were, what their fears were what their strengths were. We had 13 episodes in S1 to establish all that and the witnesses relationship and trust and not to over whelm us with too much details. Stuck in purgatory, how much could they tell us about Katrina when the battles were going on in the real world were the witnesses were. Jenny and Frank were included in the importance because they too are fighting on the real world trenches. We needed Katrina out to learn more about her point of view and I think the writers timing was perfect. She now has a reason and purpose, aside from her husband she must bring her son back from the darkness he has fallen in. S2 also has more episodes to give us time.

But going back to the interviewer I still say she could have formed her questioning more professionally. Its shows how easy going and honest Katia is to catch and point out the interviewers anger and to laugh it off, turning it to her advantage. I think the Abbie/Katrina paring was the interviewer saving herself, for being to obvious in her preferred ship. She could just as easily have meant Katrina/Jenny paring which also is popular ship. 

Katrina’s being in purgatory is not a good enough excuse for not giving her her own scenes with her own POV. Abbie was there all of a minute before we got her POV from inside purgatory. No, it was a purposeful decision not explore Katrina’s experiences there. They could have done it but they either didn’t have a story for her or weren’t ready to reveal it yet. Either way it was a bad call and the character suffered for it. And honestly, Katrina being upgraded from a devoted wife to a devoted mother still isn’t really making leaps and bounds on her being a less offensive character when it comes to writing complex nuanced women. But I will say this it certainly resonates better with me than her leaving her baby for the off chance of being able to one day get her husband back.

As for the interviewer, what about her makes you think that she was hired to be professional. Cause the died hair and the other segment where she asks them who they would fuck, marry or kill makes it seem to me that her employer’s don’t really care about that too much. I think they care more about hits on their website personally.

And I totally disagree with your interpretation about what went down with that interview. The reason she mentioned Katrina and Abbie specifically and not Katrina and Jenny was because Katrina and Jenny can be seen as that side ship people use to get Katrina out of the way so Ichabbie can happen. When she said Katrina and Abbie it implies that Ichabod is the one in the way not Katrina. And the interviewer probably wasn’t angry, just confused about how Katia so badly misinterpreted her question and tone. Not that I’m defending the interviewer so much, she could have definitely worded it better. And honestly I don’t think Katia turned it to her advantage at all, but I’m going to be gracious and leave it there. I actually feel bad for Katia, the fourth wall is disappearing (to my incredible dismay) and Sleepy Hollow seems to be on the fore-front of the onslaught (thanks Orlando!). It is getting clearer that the actors and the TPTB on this show are incredibly ill-prepared to deal with… all this.

But Abbie is the star of the show, a witness. We had to see her POV first and foremost. Plus what exactly could have been Katrina’s point of view at that stage. We saw how she saved her husband, we so how she searched and returned to have her coven surround her, we saw how and why she had to save her son from literally every force with little help….all from second part POV, because as you said she was a plot device. She was used to motivate Ichabod and show us a side to him we hadn’t seen at that point. A husband and father going after the monster with an axe, when normally he hides behind Abbie and her gun. An like I said. I am one of the minority that could happily wait for Katrina’s moment…but in the real world were she could tell her story in her POV, not stuck in a realm were only the audience could hear it, but couldn’t see her deal with it.

what would you like me to call the interviewer? a random stranger with a microphone? she was wearing a press badge, my friend working for her blog was also present at the event so I know all interviewers had one. If she wasn’t conducting in a professional manner then I’d imagine she’d he hulled out for gate crashing.  Even if she was working for a backward website, there is still a way to conduct interviews. Even a paparazzi is a professional at his job.

As too disagreeing with my interpretation. You are welcome to do that, as I am with yours. I looked at Katia’s stun reaction to how the interviewer asked her question and how she recovered from it. I also interpreted the women give a quick look at the camera and back at Katia, not expecting Katia to be so forward. That’s my interpretation and you are free to disagree.

I believe the writers do have a plan and I am going to trust them to deliver. I am patient enough to wait. Plus I watch more than one show to keep me preoccupied. I am glad about Katia’s remark that Katrina will surprise us all. 

Just gonna say this, the rest we can agree to disagree. Katrina was one of the four leads in Season One. Yes, Abbie is one the main protagonists but even she wasn’t given the same importance as Katrina in terms of plot. Frank who is even further from the plot got his own POV even when it felt forced. What would it have served to show Katrina struggling with her captivity in purgatory? Well a greater portion of the audience might be more emotionally invested in her and Katia might not have to be fielding questions about Ichabbie but questions actually relevant to her character.

I’m glad you are happy to wait. I am too for things that tend to be inconsequential in the scheme of things. But the writing for Katrina is a shameful representation of women in media and I’m not gonna sit around and wait hoping that that will change without criticism.

Maybe its because I saw the show whole in one night. I didn’t watch it with weekly breaks to analyse events and situation. I also watch multi-cultural and lingual TV, so I get a wide range of how women are represented in the media.  You are free to criticise, I’m not disputing that. Its clear we see the show with different expectations.

Yes Katrina is one of the leads. But the show importance is the witnesses, Abbie and Ichabod. As I have said Frank and Jenny are in the real world, their ties, issues, the situations they had to face were in the real world with Abbie and Ichabod. What else could Katrina do but help as much as she could from her captivity. If she was able to show more power…then the obvious questions the fans will ask is “Why doesn’t she free herself” “Why does she wait”…if we got a Katrina POV from her side…”Then what help or relevance is that to the current situation the witness were facing” “What help could they give her at that time, that they couldn’t give her anytime”

I am looking forward to Katrina’s point of view more in the real word because she wont be standing, retelling a story. This time she will be able to do something about it, with or without the groups help. If she feels guilty about leaving Jeremy then she will act on that guilt and go after him, not stay stuck in a cloud world reminiscing. If the group needs a witch, there she is…..now able to learn more about her powers maybe even make her own coven.

I just see more potential with her out rather than in purgatory. An now the stage is set, with her husband and son being her driving force.

You shouldn’t be disapponted with how the show is representing this one female character. The show has two strong females already. In my opinion the show has 5 strong females. Katrina, Abbie, Jenny, Macey and Cynthia…..its just that they are all individual personality and will grow in their own strength as they progress.  

Why can’t we have six?  Why did they drop the ball on the one character, that on paper, could have been more intriguing than a police captain from NYC?  We’ve seen how well the writers have done for the women, even a character that showed up for two episodes (Cynthia).  Why exactly does the writing for Katrina get a pass, when they’ve shown what they’re capable of with Abbie, Jenny, Cynthia, and Macey? The writers could have easily incorporated her POV into the overall plot, but instead fell back into the “damsel in distress” and “torn between two men” tropes.  Then, at the moment to show her as a powerful witch, they neutered her.  It’s disappointing, especially after reading one of the early scripts for the pilot where her GHOST performs the scenes which were given to the Reverend.  The character could and should have been more than what they presented to us and they shouldn’t get a pass for that.  

I’ve been tagged

You can tell a lot about someone by the type of music they listen to. Hit shuffle on your ipod, phone, itunes, media player, etc. and write down the first 10 songs. Then pass this on to 10 people. One rule: no skipping.

  1. Zeigeist - Fight With Shattered Mirrors
  2. The Lumineers - Stubborn Love
  3. The Shins - Caring is Creepy
  4. Flo Rida - Club Can’t Handle Me (don’t judge me, it’s fucking catchy)
  5. alt-J - Breezeblocks
  6. Oh Land - Lean
  7. Swedish House Mafia - Don’t You Worry Child
  8. Passion Pit - Take a Walk
  9. Architecture in Helsinki - W.O.W.
  10. Alex Winston - Sister Wife

Tagging: auraispurple, viegsen, johnnie-has-the-tardis, see-you-next-tuesdayy, listen-up-bitchcakes, aaalways, aleriehightower, ghanimasun, thehayleyatwell, rochellena if you wants. 

lunablivion:

Can anyone else not wait until Fall so they can return to dressing in clothes that they actually like?

goddess-river:

Women have been denied the right to vote, treated like property, sold to their spouses, raped every time it was war, misrepresented by entitled old white politicians, been endangered every time they walked somewhere alone at night, denied the right to drive or be anywhere without a man, shamed for showing their faces, shamed for choosing not to show their faces for millennia, and still you think your biggest problem is that someone buys a mug that says “male tears”?

shes-universal:

*ride operator voice* please keep your lols omgs and your “I tried to scroll past this”s inside the tags at all times ladies and gents

danainthedogpark:

Joseph Fink is throwing shade at Steven Moffat so accurate it hurts.

jaclcfrost:

i can’t even appreciate the beauty of the sunrise after staying up all night because it’s just like. fuck. there it is. there’s the sun. i fucked up. why am i laughing. nothing is funny. the sun is there and it’s harshly reprimanding me for being awake all night. “this is the life you’ve chosen for yourself fucker” it says. i’m not laughing. i’m crying. there’s the fucking sun

askashthewiccan:

furbearingbrick:

acesnerdyart:

I was walking through a local trail next to a dog park and in big freakin’ letters Dana was carved into the tree.  The beach trees also had broken limbs that formed eyes.

there are trees around where I live that look like that too.

DONT GO TO THE DOG PARK DONT LOOK AT THE DOG DONT EVEN THINK ABOUT THE DOG PARK